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Post by ozarkmountainman on Apr 8, 2013 16:11:48 GMT -6
Do I understand correctly that the CITIES tags for bobcat and otter have been de-regulated by the Feds? Can someone tell me if this is true? What a great deal, if we don't have to worry about the tagging procedure any more. Not to mention the impact it will have on our agents in lessening their work load! Input anyone?
Dale
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Post by trkyslyr on Apr 8, 2013 16:19:19 GMT -6
I Dunno, u tell me... lol Ur the one "in the know".....
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Post by tjm on Apr 8, 2013 16:35:21 GMT -6
Dale, I saw some mention of that recently, but when I did a web search found nothing. Latest info I found was 2012 problem with defective tags. I'd think if any thing had changed the info would be out there.
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Post by bverboy on Apr 8, 2013 16:52:34 GMT -6
i sure hope so dale. there a pain...
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Post by robertw on Apr 8, 2013 19:11:56 GMT -6
Yes, the feds relaxed the tagging standards last year. (read carefully and everything)
It is not longer nessasary for bobcats and otter that do not cross state lines (taxidermsy specimens excetera) to be tagged. This greatly reduces the paperwork and work load for both agents and taxidermist. (according to the Feds, not the MDC, they have not changed the regs yet)
It is also not nessasary (according to USFWS) for the agents to personally place the tags in the pelts.
As an example in Mississippi a trapper can purchase (.25 each) and pickup 20 tags for each species when they piurchase their trapping permit. These CITES tags can also be requested through the mail as needed. Left over CITES tags are to be kept by the trapper and utilised in subsequent seasons.
All of this was reported in the Fur Taker Magazine last year.
Hopefully the MDC will get up to speed and be more progressive like some of the other state agencies.
Our Conservation agents have more important things to do than being mandated to be a delivery boys for these CITES tags. The other issue is when trappers need these tags and the tremendous work load placed on our agents in November, December and January. Many agents have on going investigations from deer season, court appearances and are trying to to take some time off because of all of the "comp" time they have built up working overtime through the deer seasons.
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Post by bigjohn on Apr 9, 2013 5:41:30 GMT -6
I don't see Mo. relaxing the regs on CITIES tags as long as they have the cat and otter surveys going on.I heard a rumor last year,that they even may require the lower jaw just to get one tagged.This was due to the poor participation of trappers turning in the jaws. That and the fact we can hold over our furs now.It would make it easier for them to catch persons poaching them after season closes.
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Post by robertw on Apr 9, 2013 12:44:58 GMT -6
Bigjohn,
Those are poor excuses for not relaxing access to these tags and the increased paper / work load for every trapper, hunter, taxidermist and conservation agent in the state.
In this world the MDC needs to work with all outdoorsmen in the state. When the sportsmen and legislaturers in this state are continually snubbed on multiple issues (proposed crawfish ban, bluecat slots, noodling, CITES tags, elimination of commercial fishing of all catfish in the Missouri River) people start to cop a less than positive attitude.
From everything (second hand info) I have heard the Enforcement Division (Agents) fully support relaxing access to these CITES tags.
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Post by bigjohn on Apr 9, 2013 13:14:59 GMT -6
Didn't say I agree with it Robert lol.Just my opinion and what I've heard.The rumor came from the bioloists side and not the enforcement side.I agree the GW's have their hands full,enforcing the law and with some counties only having one per county,doesn't help.
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Post by robertw on Apr 9, 2013 13:23:02 GMT -6
BigJohn,
I understand.
Many states allow year round possesion of fur, some of these states have now relaxed the access to these CITES tags.
The Missouri Department of Conservation is one of the best funded wildlife agencies in the nation. Hopefully they will help set the standard in being pro-active and doing everything possible to increase trapper participation and being the friendliest to all outdoorsmen.
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Post by bigjohn on Apr 9, 2013 15:34:12 GMT -6
Ithink,for the most part,they do a good job.They do support trapping and reconize it as an essential tool in wildlife management.Something we have to take in consideration is that trappers make up a very small percentage of our piece of the pie.Heck,anymore the birdwatchers out number us trappers.They have to juggle land use and resources for all the people and not just a few.It does seem that they lean towards the efforts that brings in the most money though.Turkey and deer management seems farther up on the list than small game,due to the fact it brings more money into the state.
Things could be worse though.Many states' legislatures have a hand in laws concerning wildlife and the laws concerning them and this is when regs get made using emotions instead of sound scientific data.That way of doing things will always leave the sportsman in a bad way.
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Post by tcrooks on Apr 9, 2013 16:32:49 GMT -6
bigjohn , you are correct in that every state that has their wildlife managed by legislators. The sportsmen of those state never seem to fare well. Every time the bleeding hearts end up getting the polotitions to do what they want by using emotions rather than scientific data. The MDC does tend to lean towards what brings them the most financial gain and that will always be Deer/Turkey hunting. Although not everybody in the MDC agrees with the Commissions BOD.
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Post by robertw on Apr 9, 2013 18:09:37 GMT -6
I have no problem with the MDC setting regulatins in most instances, however there are times they need to be held accountable. The nfact that they do not have to answer to the state legislature is becoming more and more of a problem. The crawfish, slot limits, and noodling issue are all prime examples. The MDC Fisheries department are cussed and discussed all across the midwest.
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Post by bigjohn on Apr 9, 2013 19:24:23 GMT -6
I believe the catfish limit is directed to help out the tournaments and vacationers.Bigger fish and more of them will draw tournaments=money for the economy,same as with folks taking a vacation.Trophies(or at least a good chance of it)draw sportsman ,who then put money into the economy as do people taking vacations in the state.This is also the reason for the 4-point rules on deer.
Wildlife management can be a tricky thing. Mo trying to build a trophy herd,only to have CWD to show up.Now the very deer they are trying to protect are the main ones they are taking out to control it,where it has shown up.
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Post by krank on Apr 9, 2013 19:36:34 GMT -6
The perfect law would accomodate sportsmen and deter poachers. I think the Wildlife Code book is thick enough.
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Post by robertw on Apr 9, 2013 20:04:18 GMT -6
The MDC used the "trophy" catfish logic to shut down all commercial fishing of catfish on the Missouri River. Now we have a resource that is not being utilised to it's full potential.
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Post by bigjohn on Apr 9, 2013 21:14:58 GMT -6
Shame we can't get a commercial market going for the asian and silver carp.
I remember back in the 70's,reading about the commercial harvest of Blue cats out of the Santee-Cooper resivour.They sent them to plants to be made into fertilizer.Maybe something like that could be started like that to provide the organic gardening folks with fertilizer.
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Post by bverboy on Apr 10, 2013 4:17:11 GMT -6
bigjohn , you are correct in that every state that has their wildlife managed by legislators. The sportsmen of those state never seem to fare well. Every time the bleeding hearts end up getting the polotitions to do what they want by using emotions rather than scientific data. The MDC does tend to lean towards what brings them the most financial gain and that will always be Deer/Turkey hunting. Although not everybody in the MDC agrees with the Commissions BOD. the bod should be elected not appointed!!!  |
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Post by trkyslyr on Apr 10, 2013 7:49:42 GMT -6
I believe the catfish limit is directed to help out the tournaments and vacationers.Bigger fish and more of them will draw tournaments=money for the economy,same as with folks taking a vacation.Trophies(or at least a good chance of it)draw sportsman ,who then put money into the economy as do people taking vacations in the state.This is also the reason for the 4-point rules on deer. Wildlife management can be a tricky thing. Mo trying to build a trophy herd,only to have CWD to show up.Now the very deer they are trying to protect are the main ones they are taking out to control it,where it has shown up. IT IS NOT MDC'S JOB TO MANAGE FOR TROPHIES!!!! IT'S TO MANAGE THE HERD!!!! SAME WITH FISH!!!!!! This whole slot ban started after they JackA$$$ from TV (monster fish guy) came to LOZ and couldn't catch over a 40 lb fish...... WHO CARES!!!!!!! The big ones taste like CRAP anyway!!!!!! The slot would cover the best eatin fish anyway.... |
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Post by trkyslyr on Apr 10, 2013 7:50:56 GMT -6
bigjohn , you are correct in that every state that has their wildlife managed by legislators. The sportsmen of those state never seem to fare well. Every time the bleeding hearts end up getting the polotitions to do what they want by using emotions rather than scientific data. The MDC does tend to lean towards what brings them the most financial gain and that will always be Deer/Turkey hunting. Although not everybody in the MDC agrees with the Commissions BOD. the bod should be elected not appointed!!! Agreed!!!!! By those that are paying for their jobs (TAG HOLDERS), NOT Yuppie tree huggers from KC and ST Louis.... I think all items up for change should have to go thru public vote, but limited to those that hold licenses in that area... I.e. if its a deer issue, u must have a deer tag., Turkey issue, turkey tag, catfish, fishing lic...... etc etc etc.... |
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Post by bigjohn on Apr 10, 2013 8:09:24 GMT -6
Don,that would be a very dangerous move to make.It would simply be buying votes and the antis would quicky jump on that.Those people would have the funds to turn the tide in their favor.
For the most part ,the ones that are appointed usually have some connection with the out-of-doors.By having them elected by the people,also allows the antis a door to enter.This would amount to regs being set due to emotions than sound scientific data and studies.
To exclude those that can't get into the out-of-doors for whatever reason,the nature centers serve a purpose.Not everyone is within a few minutes of hunting,fishing,trapping,or bird watching.The nature centers don't paint a disney type world as would watching TV.This helps those folks better understand or natural world.A plus for us.
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Goodbye 2020